By IDarwinThis is my first time to this site, and I liked all the comments. I figured I'd write something.
As I read the comments, it reminds me of the Christians I know in my life (my family for example).
From my experience, it's not the evidence that causes them to believe so much as being born into it, and then believing God has changed their life, or "blessed" it somehow.
It's like giving someone a magic pill, and telling them this has great power, and it will help you if you just believe. So they do, and they work hard, and lo and behold, they change!! And they keep on believing in this power pill and sharing the Good News to all, and you just want to wake them up and tell them its not real.
Like God, why can't they see what seems so obvious?
And for the most part, this may not be harmful to them or those around them. It might actually continue to be beneficial. So why speak out against it? Because when you look at the big picture, it becomes dangerous. Because entire lives are built on false reasoning. People's priorities become skewed. And these people can make choices based on false presumptions, that effect all of us.
One, albeit fanciful, example: What if we find out that a comet is going to destroy Earth 10 years from now. What will we as a human race do? I would worry that all the God/afterlife believers would jump at the chance to "save" as many souls as possible, seeing the comet as God's plan, and there is no need to worry for he has everything in control. Where as unbelievers as a whole would be more inclined to find a way to save the planet.
Sure, Christians can do good things, so can non-Christians. It's not about the good that happens, it's about the bad that happens BECAUSE of religion. And when these bad things happen, religion doesn't seek to change.
In my opinion, many people use God as a temporary fix. Whether its because they need a greater purpose, or social need or [insert common human condition here]. They have some need, and don't have the right tools to fix it (or don't bother to look), so they find a God to fit this need. And there ARE tools out there, to fix it right, but it might take some time and some study. God is a temp-fix, duck tape at best.
I was a Christian for a number of years. One side of my family has four generations of Pastors, with a couple of ministers on the other side too. My whole family worked (and some still work) for the church. But thankfully I questioned. I love science and logic and it was only a matter of time before I finally put religion to the test. It took me a good 5 years of further reading, studying and questioning before I was able to have a strong foundation in which to live my life. But that doesn't mean I've stopped questioning or searching.
It was scary, and it was new to me, but the more I saw the truth the stronger I felt. As a Christian, you feel you have it all together, like you are strong and unshakable. You think the non-Christians are lost, with no purpose. But for most free-thinkers, rationalists, atheists, this isn't true.
When Christians ask me, "How can you be moral when you don't believe in God?" or "If you don't believe in God, what's the point, why don't you just kill yourself?" it tells me their mind and reasoning is in a bad place. In my opinion, this is why so many of the deconverted feel more free. We can look at things like death, morals, suffering, pleasure, family, self, life, ect., and see things how they really are -- the real truth to these things as we know it now. I can give good, reality-based reasons to why I don't steal or hurt others, rather than, "Because God said so, and I love God."
I don't know it all, and I can admit that. No one knows it all. But that's no reason to assume there must be a God out there.
fjell
"And these people can make choices based on false presumptions, that effect all of us."
You are exactly right. There were many decisions I made based on "God's Will" back when I was a christian, that brought hurt, and pain into my life. These decisions that I made were based on the so called word of god, "The Bible".
Like all other christians I had been taught to refer to the "Bible" in order to find the will of God. Instead of finding his grand plan, I ended up finding disappointment, hurt, and pain. I did everything I knew to do to seek out God's will, only to be let down over and over again.
I wanted to please God, and do the right thing. All I kept on hearing from my pastor and my christian colleagues was, "I'll pray for you, keep searching, and have faith". I also kept hearing all this cheap talk about how god was going to do these big things in my life, and none of these things ever came to pass.
Hearing that type of stuff from other christians did not make me feel any better. I needed to hear from God/Jesus is who I needed to hear from. I didn't need to hear some lame excuse or some lame answer that christians gave me. They could never come up with a practical answer, and Jesus failed to reveal himself to me in a loving personal way, and provide the answers that I needed, so after years of struggling in the christian faith, I said the hell with it, renounced Christ as a false god, and I walked away from the faith back in 2004.
My father who is still a huge part of the faith has made a lot of decisions based on his christian beliefs that has hurt his family over the years. My father is a good man, however he is too blind to see the damage that has been done to his family because of his serving Jesus. If it hadn't been for his faulty faith, there are many decisions that he would've made that would've kept his family together better. Instead, christianity has divided my family.
My father is enslaved to his beliefs and he can't even see it. He is now 79 years old, and I'm pretty certain at his age, he will never change his mind.
I do not regret, nor do I apologize for leaving the christian cult. My only regret is that I got involved with it in the first place.
Poltergoost
*imagines a duck struggling to free itself from tape*
Most christians will actually scramble to find a fix for it as well, but as soon as it's found, it's "praise to god" and "thank you Jesus" and "glory to the lord" who made the fix possible. Just like when they're sick. Most of them, with a few exceptions who are really badly deluded, will still go to the doctor. Of course, it wasn't the doctor's work that in the end helped them, it was all god, but hey.... Can't give praise to the doctor, right?
Looking back on it, I always wanted to tell that person what a stupid comment they made, and that they need to learn how to appreciate a compliment.
Poltergoost
only if you can expand your thoughts enough to recognise that christians are not lazy jobless people. christian are some of the most successful people in the world. For instant lets use the, comet situation as an example. scientist, astronauts, doctors, teachers and the list goes on are christians too so you see the the scientist that found the proplem could be working for God and the astronaut that was sent off to fix it is working for God as well. I guess what I'm trying to get at is, God works in all different ways, form and places, not only in church. Hopefully your BRAIN as some more in formation to work wit alongside you thoughts, cause honestly i don't want to sit here and go on and on about all the other profession.
God works in all different ways, form and places, not only in church. Hopefully your BRAIN as some more in formation to work wit alongside you thoughts, cause honestly i don't want to sit here and go on and on about all the other profession
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Scribbling mouse,
Did you know that even xtian mice can get an education, where they can learn how to write and spell.
It's TRUE.....Cross my heart and hope to 'die'...errrr, wake up a fundie one day.
So I think you're trying to say that if a comet was headed for earth, god would use (-and abuse-) some astronomer to let us know in advance it was coming, yes?
Then god would find some humans, with BRAINS, to find a means to save our planet from this comet, right?
Gosh, I sure hope these human saviors of our planet know how to type a legible memo, so we can all stay well "in formation" "wit" god's communications through these special used humans of his.
Would these saviours of mankind have to be xtians like yourself, or does god use atheist as well in his plans to save us all?
Don't you find it odd that your god doesn't just change the path of the comet instead?
Why is it that every action you attribute to your god, always is the action of a human instead?
You SAY that your god uses humans to do his work and while that might be possible if god really existed, I find it quite strange that god NEVER does anything himself.
Why don't we see your god taking action today, like he did throughout your bible stories?
So mouse, got any proof that your god is real, other than your insistence that he works by using men to do his dirty-work?
ATF (Who wonders why the great holy spirit that dwells in this xtain, doesn't know how to write and spell any better than a house mouse?)