By Joel Stein I HAD NEVER BEEN to church before. I mean I'd been inside them for weddings, architectural curiosity and once, in college, to hear some guy play organ so I could hook up with Jenny Hodge. I'm pretty sure God will be cool with that because, as an omnipotent being, he knows how hot she was.
But I'd never sat through a service until I went to Austin, Texas, two weeks ago. This mostly has to do with the fact that I'm Jewish and don't believe in God, and sermons don't have nudity or anything to gamble on. But my college friend, Mike Langford, just got ordained as a pastor at Covenant Presbyterian Church, so I felt like I needed to see his gig.
The first thing I noticed about church was how much like PBS it was. The lighting was dim, the speakers talked slowly, the songs were dated, there were a lot of references to reading material and every so often my eye line was interrupted by envelopes asking me to donate money. Also, I kept falling asleep.
I was surprised by how many of the songs and prayers I knew, like the one where I walked through the valley of the shadow of death. I was getting pretty confident until the call and response of Kyrie eleison, when I mistakenly belted out "Down the road that I must travel." It turns out Mr. Mister played pretty loose with their hermeneutics.
In fact, I'd never realized how much of a death cult Christianity is. When we weren't fixating on how awesome Christ's murder was, we were singing about how terrific it was going to be when we bite it. Chipper up, Christians! There's a lot to live for. They're making more of those "Narnia" movies.
Still, there was also a lot of talk about peace and love and some nice meditative time. In fact, it was all going well until the interactive portion. I had foolishly thought that only Catholics did Communion. But it turns out that only Catholics, for whom the Eucharist is more than a mere memorial, do Communion well. Presbyterians use a supermarket baguette for the body of Christ and grape juice for his blood.
I figured just a few people would take Communion; the ones who needed a little extra boost of Christ that week, like a spiritual PowerBar. But every single person in the first row got up to take Communion from Mike. Then the second row. They were serving buffet style.
I panicked. Would taking Communion somehow magically convert me? And even if it didn't, would it be an affront to my lineage, to my people who died refusing to convert during the Inquisition? And wasn't it particularly bad considering it was the night of the most religious Jewish holiday, Yom Kippur? Symbols of the body and blood of Christ seemed like a particularly bad way to break the fast.
In "Ulysses," the agnostic James Joyce debates whether he should have put his principles and his pride aside and agreed to pray with his mom on her deathbed. Lucky for you I don't have the kind of space he had. With just minutes left until my row stood up, I decided that Joyce was an idiot. The whole point of being an atheist is that you don't have to believe symbolism matters.
So I decided I was going to do it, when, with just three rows left, I started to worry that taking Communion would be rude to my new Christian friends. Was I cheapening their religious experience by traipsing through it as a tourist? Basically, would this be bad for Mike at job evaluation time? Hadn't an African Catholic priest once gotten in trouble for letting President Bill Clinton take communion? I tentatively went up and gave Mike a look that I hoped asked, "Is this cool?" and he smiled and let me rip off a piece of baguette and dip it in the juice.
Afterward, he assured me that it was fine for me to have taken Communion. As we stood outside talking to the congregation, I liked how even our shared snack bonded us as a community. The interaction and solemnity was personal and communal at the same time. As the saying goes, you can't ignore someone in the supermarket after reliving the Last Supper with them.
And, as I drove away, I wished I could just make the Kierkegaardian leap of faith to belief in God and be part of it. And I realized that, postmodernist or not, my pride was just as bad as Joyce's. But at least you can understand some of my sentences.
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That is GREAT summary!! I will use it in the form of a question whenever one of those Christians tries to convert me.
Oh, and a reminder -- Pope is just poop mispelled.
I made up my mind that day that I could no longer follow a sadistic,
overly dramatic child abuser with narcissistic anger issues,..etc.
That movie was horrible,..yet these fundies lapped it up like it was gauds love letter to them,..(what a bunch of sick twisted freaks!)
*Thanks Mel for opening my eyes!
And why don't they rejoice over the death of loved ones? That's a good question. I mean, if they have "gone on" to a better place, and this place is full of love, streets of gold, gates of pearl, and all the cotton candy you can eat, than why mourn over the death of their loved ones? Okay, so they'll miss them right?
Okay, I'll give them that, but then why is it that when an individual Christian is diagnosed with a fatal disease they go to their church for prayer and healing? Shouldn't they be excited about their very near future destination? Shouldn't they be refusing any medical treatment that would prolong this painful human experience here on Earth when they can just get to Heaven NOW? Why the hell would any one want to hang around this shit hole if they can hang out for the rest of eternity with Jesus, the Old Man, and the holy spook? Why don't Christian inmates on death row rejoice at their soon departure from this world when they will be shortly enjoying the company of angels? I just don't get it. I don't know about you, but I'd be first in line for a lethal injection that would make me fall asleep peacefully to wake up in bliss. I have to say that the fact that Christians are just as afraid to die as most of us, is poor advertisement for their religion. I'd like to see Christians more enthusiastic about the Great Beyond, Heaven, Fantasia, Whatever you want to call it. I'd expect that if death is the vehicle which will take you to the best place in the whole universe, I'd be hanging on the bumper just to get there, but Christians are not so excited about it, now are they? They keep telling the driver, "I'll catch the next one." Why are Christians so desperate to hang on to this life if there's a much better one waiting for them?
I am more afraid for the death of my loved ones and never seeing them again, and that is also a major motivator, of course.
The truth is, the truth stinks. No matter how much you love someone, there comes a moment after which you will never see them again. Ever. That is hard to swallow.
I work at a hospital and I see a great number of clergy people in the rooms of very ill people praying over them. I should take them out in the hall ans ask them why they just don't pray for there hasty death so thay can make it to paradise.
You people have made points here I have never really thought about. Nvrgoingbk I love your statement that a Christian should be happy to be diagnosed with a fatal disease and should be excited about their final destination.
Obviously they really ain't all that sure of their final fate.
Wait, muslims get that? Ho-ly shit, I suddenly see the attraction :D
Shouldn't they be refusing any medical treatment that would prolong this painful human experience here on Earth when they can just get to Heaven NOW?
*************
Add to that that the patient was an eighty-plus-year-old deacon who believes issues of life and death should be left to God. The old man believed family planning is wrong and nature must be allowed to have its way because that is God's will. This means many families end up having up to six or ten children whom the mother has to bear and the father must support. RE issues of death. He believed using safety precautions such as roll bars on tractors is wrong because we need to trust God for our safety. Perhaps not everybody is familiar with farm machinery. Once in a while it happens that when working on a steep slope with tractor it rolls and crushes the operator. A law was put into place that all tractors without cabs must include roll bars. This deacon, along with the other church leaders, believed this to be wrong. Consequently, inexperienced young people continue getting seriously injured or killed due to accident.
However, when this old man faced serious heart problems he went for major heart surgery. That extended his life by perhaps a year.
If matters of life and death apply only to other people and not to aged and elderly church leaders--well, I am thinking--you know what I am thinking. The man, despite what he preached for as long as I can remember and enforced on others, had very little real faith when it came to facing death. One more piece of evidence that I made the right decision to remove myself from under his thumb.
Part of the message of Christianity is the death of Jesus Christ, but then all religious leaders die. The difference is that Christ rose from the dead. Oh I know that you don't believe it but consider this. Both the Jews and the Romans took extra measures to insure that Christ's body remained entombed. As Executioners, they had already confirmed that he was dead, but they wanted to make sure that he stayed in the grave. Roman Guards were posted around the clock. So what happened? Jesus Christ came out of that grave and was seen by over 500 witnesses over the next forty days. Now all that the Jews or Romans would have to do is produce the corps of Jesus Christ to dispell the story of the disciples. They've had 2,000 years to do it. They know where the remains of most all of their patriarchs are - but where's the remains of Jesus. If you want to prove Christianity a false religion, all you have to do is produce the body of Jesus Christ. If you can't, then just call this year 2006.
Your immature little comments highlight your small mindedness.
"The fool has said in his heart, 'there is no god.'"
Get off this site and go mentally masturabate in a prayer circle-jerk with your brain dead brothers.
The wise person says it out loud.
There are thousands of Christian websites where you amateur evangelists can spew your acidic religious jizm. Splatter your foul ejaculate there. No one here is interested.
"More people have been killed by atheists than any other single group."
This statement proves your ignorance!
I'll second the WM suggestion, go circle jerk with you friends while worshipping your invisible sky daddy!
"More people have been killed by atheists than any other single group. Hitler, Stalin, Chairman Mao were all dogmatic atheists and adherents of Darwinian evolution"
You are incorrect. Hitler was a Roman Catholic (depending of course on your definition of Roman Catholic, although the church at the time did nothing to stop him,) and he didn't support Darwinian evolution. It appears he believed in Social Darwinism, which is a separate theory popularized by Herbert Spencer, not Charles Darwin.
I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator. -Mein Kampf volume 1 chapter 2
People and Fatherland. What we have to fight for is the necessary security for the existence and increase of our race and people, the subsistence of its children and the maintenance of our racial stock unmixed, the freedom and independence of the Fatherland; so that our people may be enabled to fulfill the mission assigned to it by the Creator -Mein Kampf volume 1 chapter 8
Stalin was a Marxist dictator and an atheist, but it would be hard to prove that he was motivated by atheism. Stalin rejected Darwin's theory of evolution and the theory of genetics in favor of Lamarckism a theory which has since been discredited.
You also conveniently forget about the Christian persecution of Jews, which has resulted in countless deaths.
"Jesus Christ came out of that grave and was seen by over 500 witnesses over the next forty days"
Once again we have to assume that the Bible is factual. Are you sure it was 500 witnesses, and not just 120?
And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,) -Acts 1:15:
Here are a few questions about that assertion, just so we can begin to calibrate it:
1) What, exactly, did they see?
2) How did Paul know what they saw and how many people saw it? Was he present too? Did the people report it to him? Did he hear through the grapevine? Did he speculate? Was the passage simply a late interpolation?
3) Can you list the names, genders, or religious beliefs of any of those 500?
4) Did any of those 500 record what they saw? Do we have statements from any of them?
5) Aside from 1 Corinthians 15:6, is there any other evidence for these 500 "witnesses"?
6) Why do none of the gospel writers mention this amazing fact?
Looking forward to your reply...
Jesus's physical body was gone. Why? If it is the "soul" that rises to Heaven, the tomb needed not to be opened.
But the tomb was OPENED!!! WHY???
Because Jesus walked out, thats why, and millions have fallen for the JESUS HOAX!!!!
There was no need for the tomb to be opened, but yes, it was witnessed by many, the tomb was open. His physical body did not rise to Heaven according to scripture, the body does not rise, it's the soul that rises.
Jesus's physical body should have still been in the tomb, but it was gone!!! Why??? Because Jesus walked out, or it was carried out, thats why?
Jesus and his wiley disciples faked his death in order for the premeditated prophesy to appear to have become true.
Jesus took a boat to Japan and married and had children and was burried in Japan.
Um.. 86.....buh-bye! Adios! Christo no existo! LMAO!!!!
No one with a dab of common sense is going to believe any apologetic garbage.
Go to your christian sight and pray for your child molesting preacher buddys, you pervert.
You people?
Is that you, Mom?
I believe that he will be MOST pleased with those of us who look a the absolute silliness of the Christian doctrine, and say: "I cannot accept the fact that an omniscient omnipotent creator is sitting around worrying about whether we believe that he impregnated a human in order to create a half human son so he could have it sacrificed to himself via a horrible murder, to atone for sin that he created in the first place"
I believe that if the force that created us is watching and judging us, it will be MOST pleased with those of us who are honest and admit that we don't know what God is, and trust that whatever it is, it knows what it is doing, and doesn't need our praise or help. How can we help the power that is capable of creating a billion galaxies, except by living this brief life as well and as honestly as we can, and one of the first things we as humans have to do is quit killing each other over "My God is better than your God!"?
Dano (Agnostic)
Right...the fossil record doesn't show it. The earth is only 6000 years old, dinos rode on the ark, and we'll fall off the edge of the planet if we go out to sea too far.
And then anonymous wonders why we get angry with their stupidity.
Yes? yes?... we ARE asking for proof, BTW.... so?......is THAT your "proof"?...asking us for evidence of evolution? That's your final "answer"???....a f%cking "question"? Tisk, tisk....Jebus would be disappointed. Nonetheless, I'll play along. Okay, evolution, on any scale, is total horseshit.
Okay....where is YOUR "evidence" for God, creation, magic, firmaments, talking snakes, swimming hammers, whale-stomach campgrounds, and firey chariots???? Where is YOUR evidence for unicorns, witchcraft, talking shrubberies, bloody rivers, and domestic donkeys that speak Hebrew???? Where?...in a the pages of a book? Oh..okay, so Pinocchio lives! lol
Grrrrr..I'm so angry I could dash a child against the stones!