"“I can not believe that the federal government is charging these gentlemen with criminal activity,” said Jerome Matthews, a federal public defender representing Thompson."

Yeah, all they did was break the law, how dare the government accuse them of being criminals. Sheesh.

I know these idiots will only get a slap on the hand, but they could really get out of it scott-free by saying they were going to use the sharks in a tub for believers to test their religious faith by putting their hands in the tub while under the gift of the holy spirit. Using religion will always get special notice in a court of law, with sentences reduced and certain evidence overlooked. Religion the whitewashing of America.

Remember this people the next time you commit a crime, blame it on your religious beliefs, that you were being directed by an invisible spirit, since a spirit cannot be proved, they have to believe you're telling the truth.

"I know these idiots will only get a slap on the hand, but they could really get out of it scott-free by saying they were going to use the sharks in a tub for believers to test their religious faith by putting their hands in the tub while under the gift of the holy spirit."

Wait, a minute! No more deadly snakes tricks and drinking draino? They are definately NOT True Christians (tm)

Just more Christian Arrogance from our "men of god" and church leaders. I guess when you believe that this environment is disposable and not worth saving then you would probably do something as ignorant as this pastor. Since christians believe that God will create a new heaven and a new earth they really don't think twice about killing sea creatures that are vital to the cycle of life in our oceans. Remember these good people basically have a careless attitude when it comes to our environment and oceans.

Yeah since this world is reserved for the unjust sinners and Heaven is preserved only for Christians, then it's perfectly fine to go ahead and destroy as much of this planet and it's inhabitants as soon as possible, after all it's gods will that all things including the Earth be destroyed, since the Earth has been tainted by that evil doer Satan.

I must confess as a former moonie,
in the cult of churchianity,I had that attitude that"gauuuuud" was in control!This meant what ever I did was god ordained,and sanctioned
under "His" ability to inform me of when I strayed from his "PERFECT
WILL"....
Sounds like "Pastor Thompson" fits into that catagory, HUH!
J.T.quoted "B".. In the scheme of things this present earth will end and a new one will take it's place ,....so why care??
This bible doctrine causes more rape and destruction of our world
than greed,indifferance and ignorance combinded!!!!!!!

"his bible doctrine causes more rape and destruction of our world
than greed,indifferance and ignorance combinded!!!!!!!"

Hey guess what!! Remember that Tsunami that hit Thialand and India? Remember how all those people lost their livelihood from it and how everyone rushed to the aid of those people. That was over a year ago and they still need help. Here is were the funny part starts...you will never guess who the only group is that is still over there helping rebuild lives! Guess, come on guess! Ok, I will tell you. Christians. Yep, the only people left helping are Christians. Wow, go figure. While the intellectuals of the world sit and comment on comic strips and baby sharks and how much religion has screwed up everything...those idiot Christians are actually trying to help other people. Man, is this thing all turned on its head or what?! Hey, here is an idea...get off your high horses and stop setting up straw men that you can beat and represent Christianity in a way that acurately reflects it. Then you can "encourage ex-Christians" by showing how messed up it is. Oh, well that might just be too much work for you rhetorically trained intellectuals. It is much easier to attack an illegal act. You arent encouraging anyone here. All you guys sound like is a bunch of spoiled 16 year olds who arent happy with the Camaro your daddies just bought for you.

Hey anonymous You want to talk about the tsunami Huh??? I would really admire these so called "christians" if their only intent was to truly help people but that is not the case. Everyone in here knows their ultimate goal is to convert people in the end so they can come back home and tell pastor smith or whoever how many people they led to the "Lord". Trust me if I survived a natural disaster and I saw a bunch of self righteous bible thumping christians come to my aid with their blankets and "bibles" I would probably say THANKS but no THANKS. We all have seen christians in action and their ultimate goal almost every time in the end was to convert people. So don't hand us that BS. Remember we are exchristians and we know the true motivation behind their actions. I remember when hurricane Andrew hit and some people from my church at the time went down to help. I remember them coming back bragging about all the people they said the "sinners prayer" with. I'm not even sure if they truly helped anyone. Give me a break. If People want to help they are better off giving their money to a reputable humanitarian organization and not to a bunch of mind controlled missionaries. These people from New Orleans and the Tsunami need real help like construction workers, electricians, plumbers, nurses, doctors, etc. They need people who can truly help and not a bunch of christians whose only goal in the END is to convert them. Give me a break. I'll tell you what if the Rapture happened tomorrow this world would probably be a better place to live. I think you would be surprised when you look down from your cloud...LOL<

Annoying pain in the ass,

Listen, the churches have something to gain from poor, starving and those in "need." They'll get every penny back with their tax breaks including additional funding

You have absolutely no idea what we are doing to help and if you think that Christianity is helping, guess again – not with that stinking attitude of the those fundamentalist who said their god destroyed the city because of the homosexuals

If you volunteered your time, great! If you made a donation, Great! So did you? Are you? If you think it is necessary for one to trail behind the Christians (just for notoriety), I’ll ask you why are you not there NOW doing gawd’s work? Give up your home where you live, take only the necessities and go to New Orleans. In other words – SHIT or GET off the POT!

This is great! God tears them down and the Christians comes along and rebuilds them back up, so god can come along later and tear them back down again.

Listen if god wants a certain place in the world to be destroyed he expects it to stay that way, why else would he come along and destroy it.

You frickin stupid christians are going against gods holy will coming along and rebuilding behind god tearing it all down. What a bunch of hypocrits. You'll all will burn in Hell for that...

"This is great! God tears them down and the Christians comes along and rebuilds them back up, so god can come along later and tear them back down again."

Ben, Ben, Ben, I think you hit on something very profound...wow! Yea, if this deity wanted to destroy the city, why would “it” have his cronies to rebuild it? Leave it alone - just the way it was meant to be - as a sign of the gods' anger.

See, this is why they can pawn their religion off on the needy and weak minded...it has nothing to do with “the love of a god.”

This calls for prayer!!!

Dear god, please forgive those ignorant christians that are trying to rebuild what you've spent so much of your powerful energy to tear down, I beg that you have mercy on their filthy rotten nasty stinking souls, maybe the next time they will leave things alone and your messege will be received.

Yeah Franklin Graham sent millions of tons of supplies over to Pakistan, a (complete muslim nation) the supplies were packaged wrapped with christian tracks, bibles, christian relics, jesus supplies, etc. I bet most of the supplies were burnt, even if it meant that they would starve or freeze to death, it would seem to them that it was more important that they receive jesus, than to survive there suffering.

Anony-Mouse,

I say "No Prayer for Soup!!!" I was appalled when I saw disaster relief messages on the television screen during Katrina. The first on the list: American Red Cross. No problem there. Number two on the list: Operation Blessing. Hmmm...Operation Blessing? So I looked into it. Operation Blessing received money from the federal government under "faith based initivatives", interesting... Operation Blessing in run by a particular Pastor: Pat Robertson. WHAT????

As is enough of our tax dollars weren't already going to that shister!

I have family in New Orleans who lost everything. My Brother-in-Law went to a church in Houston for relief. The church lady (and I mean that in the most Dana Carvey way) informed him that New Orleans was destroyed by God for its wickedness in allowing gays to thrive in the city (something to that affect). He responded that the French Quarter (the area where most gays live in N.O.) was the part of the city that was spared. "Why is that?" he asked. He gave back the aid and left.

NO PRAYER FOR SOUP!

And what's with the hubris: "a bunch of spoiled 16 year olds..."? You're an asshole. Oh that's right, I forgot, a christian.

Two this time...
A drive by preaching AND
A drive by judgement

"Give me a break. If People want to help they are better off giving their money to a reputable humanitarian organization and not to a bunch of mind controlled missionaries. These people from New Orleans and the Tsunami need real help like construction workers, electricians, plumbers, nurses, doctors, etc. They need people who can truly help and not a bunch of christians whose only goal in the END is to convert them."

Guess what! Thats what they are doing! So, next time you decide to comment on the matter, get your facts straight. Sure, converts are made, but to say that is all that they do is simply ignorant.

"’ll ask you why are you not there NOW doing gawd’s work? Give up your home where you live, take only the necessities and go to New Orleans."

Well, I am going to New Orleans in March. To help REBUILD homes. And if I get a chance, or am asked why I am doing this I will tell them about Christianity. But I am going with the intention of helping people rebuild their livelihood.

"God tears them down and the Christians comes along and rebuilds them back up, so god can come along later and tear them back down again."

Ok, lets get one thing straight. THese few idots that claimed that God destroyed the city DO NOT reflect Christianity.

". The church lady (and I mean that in the most Dana Carvey way) informed him that New Orleans was destroyed by God for its wickedness in allowing gays to thrive in the city"

Case in point. She had epistemic right to say that. Its simply a matter of thinking before you speak. Sadly we all suffer from this.

Anyway, my point still stands. This site is simply a place for "rhetorically trained intellectuals" to cry about stuff that does not matter. Talk about getting of the pot.

Well as far as I know, I do not recall anyone asking for religious or spiritual help, either in N.O. or Taiwan, or Pakistan, or Haiti, Iran, Iraq, etc. whether thay want it or not thats what they will end up getting in the end.

What a christian should do is ask someone, Have you ever heard of Jesus Christ? Then of course the answer will be, a resounding yes, then that should be the end of the conversation about religion or JC.

Because JC said spread the gospel around the world, not expound it into people, if they have already heard of JC, then thats all one needs to hear, no more, ever..OK?

"Anyway, my point still stands. This site is simply a place for "rhetorically trained intellectuals" to cry about stuff that does not matter. Talk about getting of the pot."

Your point definitely stands. It stands straight out from the top of your head.

Get your proud, pissed-off, arrogant, self-righteous, know-it-all ass off this site.

When the hurricane hit New Orleans,
I bet more fundies were praying for the storm than against
it!

There is a argument for,... and against altruism.Those who help others,christians or not, are doing it for themselves.
Rewards in heaven,.. or just feeling good about oneself is it's own payoff!
I spent 15 years feeding the homeless,...sometimes I feel I did more harm than good. Then again I did for me,.. not them!
Sorry "anoy ; at 8:53 a.m.,.your naive rantings only expose your lack of intellectual maturity.

Hey Webmaster, why dont you post things that really matter? I mean post something other than the criminal acts of so-called Christians. I mean, how hard can it be to attack criminal acts. The people who post on here claim to be intellectually superior because they "think for themselves" and what-not and some of those that dont claim it come as across as arrogant. Its easy to say that someone is bad when they do bad things. So if an atheist, diest, agnostic, or whatever other group of people other than Christians does something like, oh say kill kittens with a microwave I guess that means all atheists, agnostics, diests, or whatever else love to nuke kittens. Come on, if you guys are so smart you would know that what goes on here are merely the fallacies of rhetoric known as the "genetic fallacy" and the
"straw man" fallacy. Anyone trained in rhetoric, as some claim, would know that these fallacies nullify any argument. You guys want to accomplish something, focus on what matters. The evidence.

Mouse,

You ended with: "You guys want to accomplish something, focus on what matters. The evidence."

And started with: "Hey Webmaster, why dont you post things that really matter? I mean post something other than the criminal acts of so-called Christians." Are you that dense? He IS posting evidence. What strawman? The bible sets-up the perfect "strawman" scenario: "You will know them by their fruit." The Webmaster posts their "Fruit", thereby, we get to know them. Evidence. You wanted it, you got it.

A New One...

A driveby Educator!

"Mouse,
You ended with: "You guys want to accomplish something, focus on what matters. The evidence."
And started with: "Hey Webmaster, why dont you post things that really matter? I mean post something other than the criminal acts of so-called Christians." Are you that dense? He IS posting evidence. What strawman? The bible sets-up the perfect "strawman" scenario: "You will know them by their fruit." The Webmaster posts their "Fruit", thereby, we get to know them. Evidence. You wanted it, you got it.
A New One...
A driveby Educator!"

I hope you are not one of those rhetorically trained people. You have just blown your own position out of the water! You have just shown that those people you post and rant about arent really Christians at all!! I mean if "you will know them by their fruit" then we can clearly see that it isnt Christianity that is being shown here, instead it is a bunch of "cultural Christians" doing bad things. If i plant a seed expecting a orange tree and it produces apples, guess what it isnt an orange tree. Talk about dense. Obviously you do not know the genetic fallacy but that is simply rejecting the evidence of argument simply becuase it bears, or comes from a certain group, ie "Christian". And a straw man fallacy is misrepresenting another position so that it is easy to attack. That my friend is exactly what the this site does. The 16 year old comment stands.

and the pupil becomes the teacher

Anoy,@ 9:43 A.M. I CAN TELL BY THE WAY YOU ARGUE AND COUNTER-ATTACK
THAT YOUR FRUIT IS DIFFENITLY
ROTTEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(stick that up your straw-man)!
- also-
You are'nt teaching anything but bible thumping bull-crap!

"Anoy,@ 9:43 A.M. I CAN TELL BY THE WAY YOU ARGUE AND COUNTER-ATTACK
THAT YOUR FRUIT IS DIFFENITLY
ROTTEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(stick that up your straw-man)!
- also-
You are'nt teaching anything but bible thumping bull-crap!"

All caps...nice touch. Maybe I am closer to that 16year old comment than I thought. Also, exactly how is pointing out that this site is full of fallacies bible thumping bull-crap? That, Freedy, is the genetic fallacy. You reject all that I say simply because you think I am a Christian. Thank you for the help. It is becoming clear to me that all the "we are trained in rhetoric" talk is, well, not true. Just because you read a book with the word "rhetoric" in it does not mean you are trained in it. Why dont you take some time and develop a good argument against my argument and then post. Remember only the first letter of a sentence and of a proper noun should be captalized.

Anony,..sorry about the capital letters. I was just trying to
emphasize with a little artistic
liscense. I stand corrected,...
please forgive my grammer,..or
lack of . I can admit when I'm wrong ,...how about you?

Hey Anony, This is the last time I'm going to post something in response to you because I feel you are being very judgemental and also I feel you are very dense. You say that we should focus on the evidence on this website. DUH!! When I read your statement I knew right away that you did not do your homework. This site is filled with thousands and thousands of testimonies and articles where people on this website discuss the evidence. Most of us in here spent years and years in the church and yes most of in here have studied the "evidence" ten times over. So please when you make statements like that your just making yourself look very foolish. Hey Anonymous THE WEBMASTER HAS POSTED A CHALLENGE TO CHRISTIANS REGARDING BIBLE CONTRADICTIONS!!! WOULDN'T YOUR TIME BE BETTER SPENT ANSWERING THOSE CONTRADICTIONS THEN WORRYING ABOUT THE COMMENTS WE MAKE REGARDING YOUR HYPOCRITICAL CHRISTIAN BRETHEREN!!!!

"Hey Anonymous THE WEBMASTER HAS POSTED A CHALLENGE TO CHRISTIANS REGARDING BIBLE CONTRADICTIONS!!! WOULDN'T YOUR TIME BE BETTER SPENT ANSWERING THOSE CONTRADICTIONS THEN WORRYING ABOUT THE COMMENTS WE MAKE REGARDING YOUR HYPOCRITICAL CHRISTIAN BRETHEREN!!!!"

All caps again...here we go again. Actually have read your webmasters post and to tell you the truth it would be a huge waste of time answering his objections. This is why...he is not interested in the answers. You see the problem is that the evidence doesnt really matter to you guys. In fact, I could post and post evidence on this site and widdle every one of your objections down only to watch the conversation downgrade into all-caps posts that merely attack me personally rather than the argument. Therefore another fallacy and just another reason to hold my opinion in regards to this site.

Posted by Anonymous at 2/11/2006 02:48:37 PM............
"In fact, I could post and post evidence on this site and widdle every one of your objections down only to watch the conversation downgrade into all-caps posts that merely attack me personally rather than the argument"

Before you start "WHITTLING," push the WIDDLE "other" button and make up a screen name so we can keep track of you easier!I would sugest "Homebuilder"

I personally want to hear about your humanitarian endeavors, and the career that you are putting on hold while you are building homes for the flood victims, and the salary cut you will be taking. You are an example for what all of us should be doing, and I would like to know about the sacrifices you are making for the poor and homeless.

Do you consider yourself a true born again Christian?
Dan

Thanks for your posts Anony.

Your overt rudeness illustrates and reinforces the general point made by many of these articles. Christianity does not magically change anyone's life. There is no mystical Holy Spirit sanctifying the Christian. It's all fake.

However, I will give you this: Christians do often become sanctimonious.

Thank you for illustrating that point too.

Anonymous said "You see the problem is that the evidence doesnt really matter to you guys."

Oh? Could you please elaborate on that? I'd be interested to hear how you reached that conclusion.

Anonymous: "In fact, I could post and post evidence on this site and widdle every one of your objections..."

Really! That's very impressive.

Anonymous: "....down only to watch the conversation downgrade into all-caps posts that merely attack me personally rather than the argument."

But, of course, you've decided against that course of action. It's a pity we won't get to learn from your masterful rhetoric. I suppose we'll need to look elsewhere for such a stimulating exchange. Bye then.

Anonymous said...
"Mouse,
You ended with: "You guys want to accomplish something, focus on what matters. The evidence."
And started with: "Hey Webmaster, why dont you post things that really matter? I mean post something other than the criminal acts of so-called Christians." Are you that dense? He IS posting evidence. What strawman? The bible sets-up the perfect "strawman" scenario: "You will know them by their fruit." The Webmaster posts their "Fruit", thereby, we get to know them. Evidence. You wanted it, you got it.
A New One...
A driveby Educator!"

I hope you are not one of those rhetorically trained people. You have just blown your own position out of the water! You have just shown that those people you post and rant about arent really Christians at all!! I mean if "you will know them by their fruit" then we can clearly see that it isnt Christianity that is being shown here, instead it is a bunch of "cultural Christians" doing bad things. If i plant a seed expecting a orange tree and it produces apples, guess what it isnt an orange tree. Talk about dense. Obviously you do not know the genetic fallacy but that is simply rejecting the evidence of argument simply becuase it bears, or comes from a certain group, ie "Christian". And a straw man fallacy is misrepresenting another position so that it is easy to attack. That my friend is exactly what the this site does. The 16 year old comment stands.

and the pupil becomes the teacher

Mouse,

I have a degree, not in rhetoric - I can actually make a living with my degree. I did take some "critical thinking" courses, not an expert, but not your bitch.

First, I reject your assertion that I "have just blown your [my] own position out of the water!". There is really very little in the bible that means anything to me. To bible thumpers (whether you are just a coy fundamentalist christian, a pseudo-intellectual christian, or some asshole who just likes getting into arguments and not a christian at all, it really doesn't matter to me), the word of Gawd is the word of Gawd to the faithful. To know someone by their fruit means that a christian should act "christian like". Just because someone does not act "christian like" does not mean that they are not a "real" christian. Don't even start with the "well, they never had a REAL relationship with Jeeesssuusss". That is just "smoke and mirrors".

When I see someone with the title of Pastor or someone holding an "official" position in a church, that person is a christian to me (whether you want to believe it or not). It is my right to see it that way. It is only in your dillusional world that we all must obey the rules of "rhetoric". I am not on the Debate Team. What's tomorrow rule? "Roberts' Rule of Order"? "I hereby recognize the distinguished smug-ass troll from the bible belt..."

I standby my earlier statement that the bible sets-up the ultimate "strawman" scenario. When you see church officials (people who take salaries from their parishioners) who are not acting "christian like" then it does reflect on the group who identify themselves as "christians". The bible-thumpers used other groups "fruit" as evidence (THERE IS THAT WORD AGAIN) that: Hippies, Yippies, Black Panthers, MFing Symbionese Liberaton Army, bikers, gays (add your own from here) and minorities were not as "worthy" was the WASP fundamentalists who attended my mother's church.

Isn't that convenient? When a biker screws-up, they can point to the whole group and call them "sinners" and "scum-of-the-earth". But, when a pastor screws-up, then you tell us not to judge all christians by the acts of a few who AREN'T REALLY CHRISTIAN or start with some bullshit about how we are being just as judgemental as christians.

I do not judge a man by the color of his skin, only by the "content of his character" (nod to Martin Luther King, Jr.). I hate having to cover my ass for you. No, I do not see Martin Luther King, Jr. as a "Good" Pastor, worthy of raising all of christendom to his level - I CHOOSE to see him as a Civil Righs Leader. Not for convenience sake, but for what he is really known for in the history of this country - sheeesh. I do not judge gay representatives who screw-up, or Black Panthers, or hippies, or Yippies, or flippin' Postal Employees. I really do judge based on an individual's character and not the group.

I DO judge the mis-deeds of Pastors and Church Employees. Why? Because they have a special priveledge in this country. It is because of their centuries of control over humankind. Women, gays, minorities, young people, old people, bikers, Hippies, Yippies, everyone has been "under their thumb".

I will keep this section short, I assure you that there are many examples, so here it goes:

1)They terrorize children - I know, I was one of them.

2)People who want to live out their lives with equality and the hope of the American Dream while being told that their "reward is in heaven" or that it really doesn't matter, because we are living in "the end times".

3)People who want to live their life in a way that is real for them (I'm talking about sexuality here), but will "burn in hell" for entertaining ideas (just the ideas, not even the acts) of "sins of the flesh". When you can control people's sexuality, especially their THOUGHTS of sexuality (George Orwell's Thought Police anyone?), then you really are controlling them.

I want you to understand me here - christianity is NOTHING MORE than a system of control. I WILL NOT stand around proclaiming how wonderful are the emporer's new clothes. Eventhough, that is what you are expected to do in this society.

The chrisian-wrong is tax exempt. It is in the George W. Bush White House. It is destroying the wonderful system of "checks and balances". It is making this country a theocracy. Joseph McCarthy couldn't do it, but DumbAss Dubya can. It dictates policy, talking points and legislation (they even want to Amend the Constitution to add some more "hate"). They can stand on there bullshit podiums and tell people how to vote - remember, they are tax exempt. They are destroying the planet and encouraging this administration- out-of-control not to worry about the planet because the Apocolypse is coming soon.

Here is your strawman: Anyone who represents any group not chrisian (biker, Hippies, Blacks, etc.) may be judged by their "fruit" based on the examples of a few (the Strawman), but.... Exchristians will be judged for providing evidence (which you claim that we do not have) regarding the fallacies of the control system by examples of many, many, many poor representatives (StrawMEN, if you will) of the controllers who call themselves christians. Not just ordinary, run-of-the-mill street "christians", but the paid from tax exempt funds, Christian LEADERS.

I gave money to Jim and Tammy Faye. I helped put an air conditioning unit on their dog house for them. Shove your christian leadership (I don't care if it is the Pope, Jerry Falwell, or the stupid Unification Pastor selling baby sharks) up your ass.

I sincerely hope that, in your mind, I am an angry 16 y.o. with teenage angst and that you hate me with all of your might. I am tired of trying to make myself acceptable to smug, self-righteous, egotistical, self-indulging, diarrhea-of-the-mouth, back-stabbing, spiffy clothes wearing, "get a haircut you loser hippy", gossiping, "you never had a true relationship with Jeeeeeessssussss", money grabbing, law-breaking, child-molesting control freak rapist, "women belong in the kitchen and were put on earth to serve their man", "a father must put Gawd ahead of his family", judgemental, myth believing, goddamned "christians" (whether you want to admit to being one or not).

And the pupil is still an asshole.

This time...

A driveby Pupil (who's your Papi now?)
A driveby Judgement
A driveby Pseudo-Intellectual

This is no accidental Mouse. This troll comes here and frequently tosses his/her monkey feces - I recognize the tone. Remember all of the past insults? They still apply.

Annoying pain in the ass said:

"Well, I am going to New Orleans in March. To help REBUILD homes. And if I get a chance, or am asked why I am doing this I will tell them about Christianity. But I am going with the intention of helping people rebuild their livelihood. "

Me thinks the A-hole was trying to tell us this all along.

But wait a minute - Bragging Rights! I thought the Christian tenets suggested this: Matt 6 vs. 1-4. Anyhow it's great to know that you took a SHIT and now the POT is free.

Hey South2003,
I am going to New Orleans in two weeks to help re-build my former home city by spending my money at my favorite watering holes and reveling in the pagan ritual of Mardi Gras!

Great freeman, enjoy!!! hopefully when it's all done, we can go back to enjoying the festivites soon.