I knew the bible very well in my Christianised brainwash days, and I cannot recall any mention regarding Lesbians and their behaviour being unbiblical. I think Christian leaders make this sort of stuff up.

So I guess the book of Ruth is not part of this school's "christian code" either. One girl said she loved the other girl.
Gregory Bork called the girls' behavior "scandalous and immoral". So this christian school is teaching that love is scandalous and immoral. When are the fundies going to realize that to love one another means to love everyone.
I have always been taught, as a christian, that God is Love. so how is it that when two men or two women share a true and deep love for one another it becomes an abomination?

I believe in God and I believe in Jesus Christ. I am often times ashamed of being lumped into the same heep of hypocracy as these other so-called christians.

Homosexuality is not a choice! It is a biologically programed perception. Homosexuals are God's children also. He made them that way and He loves them that way. The so-called christian leaders are going to be very surprised one day when they find out that "Judge not lest ye be judged" includes them too.

For the girls in this story, I hope they will win but I also hope that they will choose not to return to that school because they are obviously not getting a decent education.

for the first comment-yeah the bible does talk about homosexuality - Soddom and Gomorrah -two angels visited lots house to get him out of that city because God was going to destroy it cuz it was wicked and do you know what the people said to Lot when they found 2 angels were at his house. the men wanted to have sex with them -
i'm not saying homosexuals or lesbians go to hell just for being the way they are but i am saying that if God had inteded this to happen it probably would've been Adam and Steve not Adam and Eve. I believe in tollercance as long as no one gets hurt. homosexuals spread diseases and all kind of that junk doing stuff with their boddies they're not supposed to do. And for you people who say std's are more likely to happen between 2 opposite sex people I believe in abstinence which means two christian virgins united under God through the sanctity of marriage. It's not a matter of safe sex - how bout no sex till after marriage the way God intended it to be. I am a Christian and for those of you who are X i feel sorry for you because your all mixed up in your own lives you don't know what your saying or what's going on. By the way about the choice thing it is a choice because i have a friend that was a lesbian and another who was homosexual-u guys don't know anything

anonymous said:

" for the first comment-yeah the bible does talk about homosexuality - Soddom and Gomorrah -two angels visited lots house to get him out of that city because God was going to destroy it cuz it was wicked and do you know what the people said to Lot when they found 2 angels were at his house. the men wanted to have sex with them -

Well I bet the angels were real HOT! If you read on a bit my illiterate friend you will see that Lot offered the crowd his daughters. Cool guy huh? What a God he must have served!

i'm not saying homosexuals or lesbians go to hell just for being the way they are but i am saying that if God had inteded this to happen it probably would've been Adam and Steve not Adam and Eve.

Let's think about Adam and Eve for a moment. They had kids, and to keep populating the earth they must have all had sex together. So your God likes the idea of mommy screwing the boys huh? A little sister and brother action for you? SICK!

I believe in tollercance as long as no one gets hurt. homosexuals spread diseases and all kind of that junk doing stuff with their boddies they're not supposed to do.

Wow you must be very young, or just very "vanilla" when it comes to sex. I hate to break the news to you but people of all sexual orientations do all sorts of stuff in bed. Disease is spread by people who are infected coming in contact with other folks. It is just as easy to get hepatitis and AIDS vaginally as it is to get by other forms of sexual activity. I know you are very poorly educated, but you should really try to do some research before you post.

I believe in abstinence which means two christian virgins united under God through the sanctity of marriage.

No it doesn't it means that you don't have sex. The Bible says (Paul) it is better you NOT get married. So if you are a good little xtian you should do what your Bible says. Please please don't get married, and if you do, don't have children. No need to populate the world with the mentally inferior.

By the way about the choice thing it is a choice because i have a friend that was a lesbian and another who was homosexual-u guys don't know anything

They still are lesbian and homosexual. You don't "get over it." They may not have gay sex now, but if they are honest with themselves and you, they will admit that gay sex is what they want.

Anyway what are you doing hanging around with these folks, they will give you diseases [snicker] Oh wait I get it, you just want to have sex with them!

Onanite

P.S. I know you are an idiot, but learn to use a spell checker.

Anony, Jim said Lesbians, and I don't really think homosexual was used in biblical times, it referred to men with men. Could this mean it's ok for women, but not men?. Maybe biblical dudes liked lesbo interaction too! LOL (sorry, couldn't help it)

Mike, that was a very good post. I have read that the book of Ruth has been thought to be about a lesbian relationship. (I know this will drive Anony crazy!!!) I agree with what you had to say about the subject, very nicely done.

Discrimination like this makes me sad and angry. I find it to be so hypocritical that of all people, proclamed christians can't accept others for the way they are, when their role model (JC)did!

GTG, take care,

Anonymous 1/02/2006 4:43 PM, your god is a hermaphrodite, unigender, bigot. And, where do you get STD's are more prevalent with homosexuals than heterosexuals, in a comic book.

Anonymous: "It's not a matter of safe sex - how bout no sex till after marriage the way God intended it to be."

How about you find that verse, that supports no pre-marital sex in the bible. What is a concubine, you fucking idiot.
While you are trying to overcome your illiteracy challenge, why don't you call god again, and see what god really intended. Oh, that's right, you already called god, and got your message, and you're just passing it along because its not in the bible.

I called my god, he says your god masturbates on a regular basis, because he doesn't have a god woman, and his release can be seen via shooting stars.

Yes yes yes, Genesis 19:5 ". . . Where are the men who came to you tonight?Bring them out to us so that we may know them carnally".

This story is not condemning homosexuality. In this era any traveler was considered an alien or foreigner and they were not entitled to any kind of protection unless there was someone in that town willing to take them in. In that case that person would be responsible for the traveler's protection. This was an ancient and, some might say, sacred jewish tradition.

It's funny though how anonymous, like many fundy christians, fails to qoute Genesis 19:8 "See now, I have two daughters who have not known a man; please, let me bring them out to you and you may do to them as you wish;" So, rather than go against good jewish hospitality, Lot would rather allow his virgin daughters be gang raped.

This is not about homosexuality, it is about power and control.

In this story also, God is portrayed as someone who is not all knowing and all seeing becuase He needs to send two angels into Sodom to see what's going on. Why would God have to do this when He is all knowing and omnipotent? He wouldn't, of course, and I don't believe God would condone a gang rape either so this story is obviously not inspired by God.

Any kind of sex that is malicious or predatory is evil and that is what this story is about. It doesn't matter if it is homosexual or heterosexual and to use it to describe homosexuality is the abomination.

"Homosexuals spread diseases and all kind of that junk"? That is right up there with some of the most ignorant things I have ever heard! Not to mention your grammer is sub-standard.

Oh, and by the way, I am also a christian but, frankly, I am ashamed to be heeped into the same club of fear and prejudice as you, Anonymous.

By condemning homosexuality you are passing judgement and that is in direct violation of christian etthics so please do not claim yourself to be a christian unless you intend to act like one.

Anonymous said: "for the first comment-yeah the bible does talk about homosexuality - Soddom and Gomorrah -two angels visited lots house to get him out of that city because God was going to destroy it cuz it was wicked and do you know what the people said to Lot when they found 2 angels were at his house. the men wanted to have sex with them -"

Well let's not forget that straight way after that, Lot's daughter's got him stinking drunk and screwed him, and each got knocked up by him... So by this same logic incest is OK and acceptable to your gawd right? Or was that okay with gawd cause' he was stinking drunk and could not control himself?

anonymous said: "homosexuals spread diseases and all kind of that junk doing stuff with their boddies they're not supposed to do."

Do you have any clinical evidence to support that claim? I would certainly be interested in seeing the results of any study that might prove your assertions.

That entire statement is a gross generalization. It stinks of bigotry. A very fundie thing to say I might add.

Well, anonymous, I like to base my assertions on facts. So I am going to offer you a few facts to mull over.

First off, look through the archives on this site. You will find numerous cases of clergy, pastors, priests etc... being arrested for sexually deviant behavior. Including sodomy of children.

Now if you want to go pointing the finger at homosexuals, perhaps you should look at your own clergy. I will not go as far as stating that ALL clergy engages in this sort of deviance... That would also be a gross generalization. But I will point out, look at the number of instances that are being reported. I would say these are happening accross the board in all denominations at an alarming rate.

IMHO, the fact that so-called spiritual leaders are perpetrating sexual acts on minors is far more dispicable than, two homosexuals in a loving relationship doing their own thing in their own home.

So why don't you stop concerning yourself with Adam and Steve and start worrying more about what's going on right in your own church with Reverend Jerry and young Timmy. Especially because young Timmy could very well be your own son.

Cheers

PS... You go, Mike!!! Kinda fun to see them get it from both sides.

Cheers

To those who take the bible as the literal word of god. Can someone explain, how its possible for beautiful "love" for someone of the "same" gender, can exceed the love of the opposite gender, "entirely".

2 Samuel, chapter 1:

23 - Saul and Jonathan were lovely and pleasant in their lives, and in their death they were not divided: they were swifter than eagles, they were stronger than lions.

24: Ye daughters of Israel, weep over Saul, who clothed you in scarlet, with other delights, who put on ornaments of gold upon your apparel.

25: How are the mighty fallen in the midst of the battle! O Jonathan, thou was slain in thine high places.

26: I am distressed for thee, my brother Jonathan: very pleasant hast thou been unto me: thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women.

One can profess to be gay, and "never" commit a physical sexual act with someone with the same gender. If one commits themselves to another in their mind, they have a relationship.

I wonder what the bible says about bi-sexuals, or transexuals. Perhaps, god forgot to mention those groups. What does the bible say about cross-dressing, the last Pope seemed to have his own feminine line of clothing.

Anonymous 1/02/2006 4:43 PM, you're a typical fundie. Consider that the ultimate insult.

Speaking of Genesis.

Genesis 9:24 - "And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him."

What did Ham do? Hmmmm, well, if Ham just peeked at Noah, then how would he have been able to tell something just didn't "feel" right. I think Ham, porked Noah. Does that make Noah a homosexual, he appears to have been involved in a homosexual act. No? Tell, me where in the bible being raped doesn't change someones' sexual orientation. Or, is that just another missed topic of the bible.

1 Samuel:

18:1 And it came to pass, when he had made an end of speaking unto Saul, that the soul of Jonathan was knit with the soul of David, and Jonathan loved him as his own soul.

18:2 And Saul took him that day, and would let him go no more home to his father's house.

18:3 Then Jonathan and David made a covenant, because he loved him as his own soul.

18:4 And Jonathan stripped himself of the robe that was upon him, and gave it to David, and his garments, even to his sword, and to his bow, and to his girdle.

Right, just like gay people everyday make a covenant with eachother, in modern terms, its called "marriage".

1 Corinthians 6

6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,"

Well, according to Paul, it appears the last pope, will be receiving the benefits of hell. He was sincerely effeminate, with his wardrobe and demeanor. Well, just more obvious bigotry in the bible.

Well, since it appears there have already been some inputs from the bible... I'll put a few from other religious doctrine...

Homosexuality in the Book of Mormon
2 Nephi 13:9 - "Homosexuality (the sin of Sodom) is evil."

Homosexuality in the Quran

26:165-6 - What! Of all creatures do ye come unto the males, And leave the wives your Lord created for you ? Nay, but ye are froward folk.

7: The Heights

7:80-81 - Homosexual acts are condemned as unnatural. (Will ye commit abomination such as no creature ever did before you?)

26: The Poets

26:165-6 - Male homosexual activities are condemned as unnatural.

27: The Ant

27:54-55 - Male homosexuals commit abominations and act senselessly.

29: The Spider

29:28-29 - Male homosexuals acts are condemned as unnatural.

It appears god, is intolerant no matter where you find him/her/it...

The girls were not expelled because they were lesbians. They were kicked out of school because of "those feelings." Note, the article stated that no physical contact was EVER observed between the girls. With this logic, every hormonal teen in that school should be kicked out because they are lusting after someone who they are not married to.

Talk about your judgemental Paulist, worried about what others are doing in the privacy of their own bedrooms, yet thousands are sitting in front of their computers at home, looking at porn and jacking off. Disgusting.

I think Jesus' overall message was to be more concerned about your relationship w/the "Father" than what others are doing.

Seems funny that as much as homosexuality is apparently condemned in the bible, I have seen too much evidence of it being practiced by clergy.

A friend of mine of nearly 40 years struggles daily with his sexuality and the apparent biblical condemnations of homosexuality. He has tried for so long to come to terms with it, but still fears gawd so much that he denounces it.

I hate seeing him struggle so much and just wish he could finally come to terms with who he really is. But he has that xian mind virus which makes it far worse.

About 20 years or more ago, he attended a big Assembly of God Church. He had put aside his sexuality and even married a woman. They both attended this church. He was even a member of the church choir.

He told me that at one point the pastor's son approached him for a sexual favor. He said he was married and no longer did that.

The next week, the pastor approached him about his past and kicked him out of the choir. Telling him that gays who have given up that lifestyle would never be anything more than second class citizens in heaven.

Needless to say my friend left the church. He eventually separated from his wife and went back into the gay lifestyle for some time. Though now he says he's completely celebate due to his fear of gawd.

The pastor's son however was soon after caught engaged in the act mutual oral sex with a male evangelist on a couch in the rectory as the entire church board walked in to witness this spectacle.

This scandal was quickly swept under the carpet and the pastor was forced to step down from his position without being exposed to the entire congregation. A little poetic justice for the way he treated my friend perhaps...

The pastor now serves as a senior advisor to the church. The evangelist was completely defrocked and is now a minister of the Metropolitan Community Church.
And the pastor's son was sent to one of those xian sponsored homosexual deprogramming centers. Which didn't work for him, by the way, and he ended up moving to San Francisco soon after.

You know Paul in the NT had what he called a "thorn in the flesh." Since he never married, I could only guess what that was....

Cheers

cdmon, you don't know how close you are to the truth about Paul. Listen to what he said to the Romans:
"But sin, taking opportunity by the commandment, produced in me all manner of evil desire." 7:8 A little further on he says,
"But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members." 7:23 "Nothing good dwells within me that is flesh".

Wow, doesn't this sound like a deeply religious man steeped in denial and self loathing regarding his own homosexuality?

Skipping the bible crap, what about the constitutional rights of these young girls? Or did the boy king "W" create another law declaring innocent teens guilty without the proper actions and investigations taking place?

It is getting sicker and sicker to see people presumed "guilty" and then having their lives placed on a platter for the fundies to feed off of just like vultures...

By the way, in africa over 78% of the population has either HIV or AIDS and most of them are heterosexual... maybe they were being punished for being poor, without proper medical attention as well as preventative measures to stop the spread of disease...or is it that most of the 78% are a different color than the government officials? Why does a government or a church get to dictate who dies? Because they feel superior to the "minority." Isn't there something in the bible in regard to pride, or ego, or judging of others???

Blows your theory outta the water don't it?

SHAME ON YOU!

Mike,
I find this passage intriguing as well...

Romans 7:15 "For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I."

Yeah, denial and self loathing or just plain self justification.

Cheers

god_not,

I saw an interview with Bill Clinton on tv about his crusade to get pharmacutical companies to sell drugs for hiv infected children in China. He managed to negotiate with these companies to sell these drugs to them for a price of $230 per year per patient. The same drugs in the US cost $10,000 a year per patient.

Seems interesting that the same companies sell the drugs here for that much more.

Clinton mentioned that 8000 people a day are dying of aids. More than the war. In many places it is an epidemic.

It is a horrible disease, and I lost a friend to it a few years ago.

Aids is not a respector of persons, and does not single out homosexuals. Heterosexuals are getting it, innocent children are getting it.

The interview showed people selling their blood for money and either contracting or spreading it that way, and showed their government trying to ignore the problem.

AND, I'm not thoroughly convinced that it all started by somebody fucking a monkey. As some urban legends have depicted.

I have a strong feeling it was more related to a contamination of vaccines that were being developed from cells found in monkey kidneys back in the 1950's.

So as far as it being a judgment from gawd... to those who would suggest such a thing I say you could only wish.

This disease only goes to prove if there is a gawd he is definitely asleep at the wheel.

Cheers

Anonymous: "for the first comment-yeah the bible does talk about homosexuality - Soddom and Gomorrah -two angels visited lots house to get him out of that city because God was going to destroy it cuz it was wicked and do you know what the people said to Lot when they found 2 angels were at his house. the men wanted to have sex with them -"

You are one fucking retard...I couldn't continue reading your shit because it would have meant my lunch!

god_not: "By the way, in africa over 78% of the population has either HIV or AIDS and most of them are heterosexual... "
I'm not entirely sure that 78% of the African population is infected with HIV... please reference.
cdmon:
I like the way you think. I have heard the vaccine theory before (a very long time ago, in fact) and I'm more inclined to believe that this was the likely development of our present challenge.
To all:
You seem to be a fairly intense and intelligent group of young people, I think I like you. A word to that anonymous person and to the regulator of this forum: It seems unlikely that a person who claims to have homosexual friends would take such an effort to condemn homosexuals, I don't believe you know any homosexuals, either ex- or presently active. I know it isn't the practice to censor liars (they are rather celebrated in our society, aren't they?)but I would cheerfully disregard anything that writer(s(?)) might say in the future.
Good journey,
Sadisticom

wow. I botched my own bloody name.
I am SADISTICON,
kneel before me worthless worms

According to the Bible, homosexuals do go to hell.
1 Corinthians 6:9-10 9 "Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God."
It's stated pretty clearly.

And as for love, there is a difference between sex and love. Sex is two people becoming one; "love is patient, love is kind..." (1 Corinthians 13:4) Therefore, if you love someone, it means you care about them, you'll always protect them, trust them, hope for them.
Just like Jesus loves you, because He died for you. That's the ultimate act of love.

Anonymous, what makes you think we care what the Bible has to say about anything? This is Ex-Christian.Net. We are not Christians. We think the Bible is a work of fiction. Quoting scripture at us will not convince us of anything.